Episode 9: Plain Talk 2023: Growing Literacy Momentum

Narrator:
0:04

Hello literacy leaders and champions. Welcome to literacy talks the podcast series from Reading Horizons dedicated to exploring the ideas, trends, insights and practical issues that will help us create literacy momentum. Our series host is Stacy Hurst, professor at Southern Utah University and Chief Academic Advisor at Reading Horizons where reading momentum begins. Joining Stacy are Donell Pons, a recognized expert in literacy and special education and Lindsay Kemeny, a Utah based elementary classroom teacher. Today's episode is a whirlwind wrap up of the recent plain talk conference in New Orleans. From highlights of the keynote addresses two takeaways and tips from three packed days of conference sessions. You'll get all the conference highlights. Let's get started.

Stacy Hurst:
1:01

Hello, and welcome to this session of literacy Talks. My name is Stacy Hurst. I'm the host and I'm joined by Donell Pons and Lindsay Kemeny. And this week, we have a fun topic, we all just returned from Plain Talk conference. And so I think that is what we're going to talk about this is Lindsay's topic, so she gets to lead our conversation. So, Lindsay, let's get started.

Lindsay Kemeny:
1:27

Yes, it's the plain talk about literacy and learning is put on by the Center for literacy and learning. They put it on every year. I think it's one of the biggest conferences that's grounded in the science of reading. We had, you know, I heard a couple different numbers. I heard there were 2500. Attendees, I heard there were 3000 attendees. So somewhere around there. Any overall observations that you guys had and want to share about the conference? I think it was bigger than last year? I could feel that. Donell?

Donell Pons:
1:58

Once you can tell, I've been prepped with my question. So I was waiting for my very specific question. But I will give my overall impression. And say that I am really pleased that I can attend. This is a conference that I didn't even really know about a few years ago. And being able to attend has been a real pleasure. And there are educators that you meet at this conference, you might not see it other conferences, because I think we've talked about Ida and some other conferences. This one is really educator and administrator centric. So there's a whole group of people that you're going to meet and be able to rub shoulders with and have conversations with within some of the sessions that you attend, that you might not normally be able to do. And I always love that.

Lindsay Kemeny:
2:37

Yeah, we all had that conversation with all of us how there were so many networking opportunities, this time when we felt like, you know, maybe we just went to things were a little more social, I don't know. But then also just, I feel like I passed so many people in the hall. And then we were like, Oh, hey, and could go and chat. And so that was really fun.

Stacy Hurst:
2:56

Yeah, that's what I was going to say. And maybe instead of networking, just say that sense of community, right? Like it did give us opportunities to connect with all kinds of educators. And if you're at that conference, you're more likely to be like minded, right? Or at least willing to learn the things that the science teaches us about teaching reading and supporting that. So I thought that was really fun. And yeah, I liked the the overall vibe.

Lindsay Kemeny:
3:26

Well, it's just there's something special about being at these conferences where, like, you guys were saying, we're like minded everyone has, you know, we're all kind of united in our purpose and in our passion. And I just, you know, I sit in there in these like keynote sessions and these breakout sessions, and I'm just thinking, These are my people. Like, I just love everyone there. They're all as obsessed about literacy as I am. So it's awesome. And we met some listeners, that was really fun, too. So it was just it was great all around. So let's start by talking about keynotes. There were three keynotes one each day. The first one was Hamish Brewer. He's kind of like, his nickname is like the skateboarding principle. He's an author. He's from New Zealand. Donell, what did you think about his keynote?

Donell Pons:
4:22

You know, I think I told Lindsay he's, he's very dynamic. Yeah. And and his brand of dynamic is to kind of it feels a little bit like yelling, right and I'm a soft spoken I like think he doesn't feel

Lindsay Kemeny:
4:33

like yelling. It

Donell Pons:
4:36

was like, okay, there we go. Let's just say it. So it took me a minute to adjust Shooto to to what I was hearing, but I loved his enthusiasm. You cannot deny man is very enthusiastic about students and about learning and about helping his students learn. And he started what would continue to be a theme and I'm sure that was intentional, but it will continue to be a theme of taking the focus off of Talking about the challenges of meeting the needs of different populations and groups. And just focusing in on, these are all our kids. And they all come with various needs, we need to figure out how to meet them best. And that's it. So, you know, you can have different discussions about things and kind of get lost in conversation on these issues. But the focus was always put squarely back on, let's just meet the needs of our kids. And I love that.

Lindsay Kemeny:
5:23

Yeah, he said, something I love. He said, I've never met a child who can't learn. And that was just, you know, I love these little, you know, quotes. I started that in my notes. And then she had a slide well, he was talking all about just like challenging that deficit thinking, those low expectations, you know, and just challenging that, because we can have high expectations for all our students. And then the second day is the Zaretta Hammond was our keynote, she has a book called culturally responsive teaching in the brain. And she's a former high school teacher. And now I think she mostly does consulting. And so she was talking all about literacy for joy and justice. Any thoughts on her?

Donell Pons:
6:09

You don't, again, what I loved is that we could get talking about these various kinds of polarizing conversations we have when everybody says culture, I think there's some people get their backup. And that's been demonstrated across the country, I think, in different settings. But I loved the way that all of these speakers had a way of bringing the conversation back to just talking about helping our students be able to learn helping the kids and our students be able to learn. And that was the focus, refocusing everybody re energizing everybody around that and trying to get rid of the kind of discontent and concern over how we may have feel differently about various issues and challenges in our communities, but refocusing everybody back on meeting the needs of our students as learners.

Stacy Hurst:
6:51

That was which I think that's the purpose of a keynote, right? And it sounds like the all three speakers did that I spoke with an educator this morning, who brought up Hamish brewers talk. And she said that her greatest takeaway was that he reminded her of the why, you know, and asked us all to think about that. And I think that's really important, because it does set you off for a great day of learning, right? Like you're kind of calibrating and then you're ready to go.

Lindsay Kemeny:
7:20

Yeah, I love something. Zahra said, she said, joy comes from productive struggle. And I think that's so true. We can't skip that, you know, part, like, especially as we're thinking of teaching to read is sometimes it can be a struggle, but the joy is going to come from that. And they're going to appreciate the things that they learn, you know, they're going to learn better that way.

Donell Pons:
7:42

And Lindsay, I would say also teachers and educators, administrators, they need to also be as kind to themselves and apply that to themselves, right? Because I've met a lot of educators and administrators who are on a very steep learning path in learning much of this science of how we teach reading. And there needs to be a lot of grace given to themselves as well,

Stacy Hurst:
8:03

like the it's an efficacious struggle to, and I think that's different than just struggling, right? Yeah. And the reason it is efficacious is because it is grounded in science. And I think that's where as educators like you're saying, we can give ourselves lots of grace, and room for practice, because it will be efficacious. And we know that because we have the research to say that right? Other people who have had success with these things,

Lindsay Kemeny:
8:31

well, I never really thought of that hurt, quote, joy comes from productive struggle. I never really thought of that in terms of teachers. So I loved all that you brought that up because it's true. This can be a struggle learning these things. Like you said, Stacy, this is not just a struggle, you use the word efficacious, has already used the word productive, you know, something is happening, something positive is happening from the struggle so and then our last keynote was Malcolm Mitchell. He is a former NFL football player. And he struggled to read. And I was just really delighted by his presentation. He said something he said, I'm fearless on the football field, but fearful in the classroom, that really hit me. And he talked about just his struggle to read, and how he decided I'm gonna start reading more so I can get better more. And he I think it was Jay Z, who he really looked up to as a child, and he talks about always seeing his music videos, but he didn't talk about reading and his music videos. So he was surprised when he like, heard an interview or something. And JC was talking about the importance of reading and books. And that helps to kind of start him off by I'm gonna start reading and it was so fun. They show this little video, he joined a book club with a bunch of like, 40 year old women in the club and then him and it was really, it was really fun to see. So he and he's an author now and he's written Some books, so he was great.

Stacy Hurst:
10:02

I think we can't hear from people like him enough. And maybe Not we but students specifically, I think about on the university level, a lot of our athletes struggle to read. And I don't think that's specific to being an athlete. But it certainly seems over represented in that category. So I think that's a really good example.

Donell Pons:
10:27

You know, what I loved about him too, is he had a really good way of drawing the parallels between how hard he worked as an athlete to become that top level athlete. And he knew how to do hard things. He just didn't realize that he could apply that same thing to reading and needed to. And I know that was really interesting, and helping our students to see that they do really hard things all of our students do. You know, even a student who feels like I don't really, I haven't really accomplished it, there's nothing I really do. Well, you show up every day to this space, that's really difficult to be in, you do that every day, that's really difficult to do. So somehow you do it, you show up. And they need to realize that they do hard things. They know how to do hard things and to help them.

Lindsay Kemeny:
11:07

Okay, so let's talk about some of our sessions. The first thing I want to ask is that you share a session that you found really useful, like you came away with maybe something specific that you could implement something that was really beneficial for you, Donald, you want to go first and then we're going to see see.

Donell Pons:
11:28

You betcha. So I mean, there were a few I had some more than a few, there were some really great ones. But even just this morning, one of the sessions that I attended, impacted a teaching session just this morning, which was fantastic. And I had been thinking in my mind when I attended the session of a particular student. And I was really thrilled that it already came to be that we were, you know, thinking about what happened in the session this morning. And that was Julie Washington, Dr. Julie Washington, and she had some folks presenting co presenting with her. But essentially, and Julie does a lot of fantastic work in the arena and field of reading. But the one thing that she talked about that was so interesting and has for quite a while, is a thing that in the past has been referred to in reference to as code switching. And that is really around dialectical differences. However, there's new terminology and a new way of thinking. So we got this new terminology. And it was a thing called translanguaging, or trans language, not code switching. So they've moved away from kind of a way of talking about and thinking about, and that really, really did that shift. And just hearing this as a new perspective, really did impact some of the the teaching and just kind of practices that went on. So just those small things that you think you just had a shift in terminology and a shift in thinking about something can be really impactful and important.

Lindsay Kemeny:
12:48

Thank you. And I love that you were able to think about that just this morning, as you were working with a student, Stacy, is there a session that you found especially useful,

Stacy Hurst:
12:58

and so many, and of course, in this in the setting that I work in? I'm thinking about Amy Siracusano's session specifically about sentences. And I know that we are working on the higher ed level, teaching our students more about the science of reading, and we're doing better than we ever have, right? A long way to go. But I will tell you, when I start talking about those upper strands of the rope syntax, specifically, my students have had experience learning a little bit about that stuff. And it is obvious because their eyes glaze over. And they think, and some of them are thinking about diagramming sentences and all of those fun things, but Amy Siracusano did one activity, she had a lot of great information, she was actually taught a lot by William Van Cleave, and that was apparent, but she did it sentence be the sentence activity where the students acted out. And I thought, you know, even in my pre service setting, I can use that and I think that will be helpful for them. And that was an activity. But you know, the context of that activity was very powerful too. And the fact that we need to do a better job of teaching our students those specific strands of their rope.

Lindsay Kemeny:
14:19

Okay, that was one of the ones I had down to four useful sessions was Amy Siracusano session, it was called, like, what the sentence has to do with it. And so I loved that be the sentence. So every every student that she had up in the front, you know, they would hold a card with a word on them. And then they need to put them arrange themselves in order so it makes sense in a sentence. And then she would like group some so she might give, you know three words to three students and say you're a unit put yourselves together. And so it might be like in the morning, right and so they have to put themselves in the morning. And then you know, she would start with the colonel sentence and then she would add some students in And, and then they would practice rearranging different orders for the sentence. And then she also said, like, she might have some kids with cards out in the audience that are synonyms. And so she could say, Oh, does anyone have a better word than sad that we could use in the sentence, and then they could switch places. And so I thought it was really good, really helpful. Another session that I thought definitely focused on how was Pam Kassner session, which was actually called the power of how, right? And it was great, because she was going through different routines, like different blending routines, and she had us practicing them. So it was very much focused on how how do I do these things. And one thing that she said that I love is that she said, if it's been taught, but not mastered, there's probably a practice gap. And I think that's huge. Sometimes we teach and then we're like, oh, my gosh, they don't know it. And we haven't really thought about how many practice opportunities that student has had. So I thought that was a great reminder. So her session was was excellent.

Stacy Hurst:
16:06

Yeah, you know, Jan Hasberg session was really applicable to and she talked about levels where what level is my student on, she recommended using Scarborough's reading rope in conversations with parents as well and saying this is where clearly pointing out on that rope, where we would expect that student to be given their grade level, and then showing them where they are. And maybe steering away from there on this particular level. Just putting it in terms of developmental I thought that was very replicative to

Lindsay Kemeny:
16:36

I wanted to go to that session. I'm sad. There were so many good ones at the same time, Danelle.

Donell Pons:
16:42

So along that same level, there, I think that you can also pick up a lot of things while you're sitting in a session when you watch the response of individuals who are sitting in the session, and they're asked to do something. So I thought that was really interesting, I paid attention to those around me, and realized on a few sessions that people didn't have enough understanding, to be able to participate in the conversations that were then asked of us. So I thought that was interesting. And it really was, I wrote down notes to say, Oh, that's really interesting to see that we didn't get provided enough information. I had enough background information. But I realized that for some of the folks around me, this was new information for them, and they didn't. So again, being in a mixed setting where some of us had more information and more background knowledge than others, which would be a typical classroom is even folks who are really good at presenting, there wasn't enough information provided. So the response that from some of the individuals who were attending, some of them were concerned or upset, you know, I don't think that this was correct. And really, it wasn't a response to the information. It was the I don't have enough information. And that was really interesting. So that happened a few times. So I was making a note of that as an educator. And the other thing that was always driven home was less teacher talk more student do so you kind of touched on this too, a few minutes ago, less teacher talk more student do I think we can say that not enough times. And then the immediate feedback piece how important that is, even for adults, I mean, even the adult setting, that immediate fit feedback was very important. And I think the session that I was in where this was very apparent to me is when we were talking about morphology. And you know, of course, everybody's really it's a buzzword, people are very interested. But it was interesting, because it was kind of assumed that we understood the difference between how you how you approach a word if you're after syllabication for pronunciation, and how you would approach a word if you're after meaning with morphology. And there was obviously a disconnect between what the audience understood of that activity. And so what we were being asked to do. So there was general confusion from a few folks and I thought, oh, I need to be really careful with that myself. It's always a good reminder, to pay attention to what you're saying.

Lindsay Kemeny:
18:44

Yeah, because you can break a word multiple ways. You can break it by syllable, or you could break it by morphine, right? Let's move on to a session that really either challenged your thinking or just made you think, or that you've learned something new. Something like that. And Stacey, let's start with you this time.

Stacy Hurst:
19:03

Okay, well, first of all, this made me just showing how little I know I think I shared this with you guys already. I really, I've always been respectful. I've always enjoyed hearing Devin Kern speak, but I think he's becoming more of a favorite of mine. And maybe some of that is because we both are in a teaching situation. And I can like relate to a lot of what he says. But this blew my mind. He was talking about the power of words and always that we're not we're not teaching anything in isolation. We're connecting meaning every time that we're teaching even phonics, right. And so one thing that he said was not to sacrifice meaning in the service of words. So this may fall in the area of practicality to but he was saying don't use words like Pipkin and Hobnob when you're trying to teach syllable division skills, because those aren't words that students would know that meaning of Be very careful in your selection of those words. In that session he had on the board this word and I'm gonna spell it. It was vict u a l s, right. I've seen that word before I've read it. And I've said victuals. Turns out we pronounced that word vittles. I did not know that. So if you want to talk about something that really challenged my thinking that word did, but I learned something new. So I think that was great. One thing that made me think, in Patti Montgomery's session, and we've mentioned this too, but at plain talk, what I really appreciate, we talked to a lot of educators, a lot of teachers, but also a lot of administrators. And Patty Montgomery's session was directed towards principals, but she talked about coaching. And again, that's something else I have experienced with in my career. And two is talking about how you always have 10 to 20% of teachers who are wanting to be coached, right? And they'll go to the literacy coach, and they'll work with the literacy coach, but those of us who have coached know, it's frustrating to think about the other 70 or 80%, what do we do with them? Right? Well, she pointed out that they're not our responsibility that the principal should be coaching those teachers that aren't really asking for it, or actively engaged with the coach. And I wouldn't say that challenged my thinking. But it really made me think how powerful that would be if that one thing changed in every elementary school, if that was the only thing that changed, I think we'd see a lot of really beneficial outcomes from that. Anyway, I thought that was yeah, I never thought of

Lindsay Kemeny:
21:39

that before to have the principal do it. That's great.

Donell Pons:
21:43

So I was in that same session as Stacey with Patty Montgomery. And it was a really interesting session. And I think I'm going to mention that one too, because I sat next to what turned out to be a principal from an elementary school and a tremendous individual doing some really good work and doing your best work. And her intentions of being a principal such good intentions wanted to be the principal that she felt she didn't have, I mean, what a great way to come into the field wanting to be that principal that inspires and supports teachers. So you feel like you got what you need as an educator in the building. But also acknowledging in the short time we were together, feeling more comfortable to acknowledge this is a huge learning curve to be involved in the science of reading is a huge learning curve, doing the parts doing her part doing the pieces, but it's a lot. And also remember that they have a full time job at the same time, right? So there's, we're asking a lot of individuals, and she said, it's a whole shift in thinking I received and went through, I'm not alone. She said, I know, through my education and programming to become a teacher, and so on and principle, never having received the education in the correct information as to how we teach reading the science behind how we really teach reading. And this is all new to her. And so she acknowledged that there's been a lot of difficulty in picking this up. Because there just isn't the time to dedicate that you would love to be able to dedicate that you could if you're intentionally taking these courses as a student, we have to remember that as well. But I loved the passion behind it the desire to want to do her best. And she's not alone. I've met many, many individuals, but she kind of encapsulated that for me. And sitting in that session. She was really taking all of that to heart about understanding the role that she plays in the building, but also feeling a bit of trepidation inside of her like, oh, I don't know that I have all of the things right. The accoutrement, shall we say, Stacy, there's a word for you that you can add the things that I may need in order to accomplish that task. So it can be difficult.

Lindsay Kemeny:
23:41

Okay, I just have to say we were challenged to try to use that word. Podcast, John Liu, when literally gets

Stacy Hurst:
23:49

brownie points, and brownies.

Narrator:
23:55

Get all the resources discussed during literacy talks, podcast episodes, and stay up to date about webinars and other special events from Reading Horizons, go to reading horizons.com/literacy talks and subscribe to our podcast digest. So you're always in the know about everything literacy.

Lindsay Kemeny:
24:18

All right, so a session that really made me think, okay, there were two. But the first one is Nancy Hennessy. Oh, she was a delightful speaker. I really loved her. She was talking about comprehension. And she was saying that too often we focus on the product, like when we're thinking about comprehension, versus the process of comprehension. And so like, think of the product, like you read the story, and you have a student do a book report, or you have them write a summary or something at the end, but we need to think more about the process and think about the strategies you use and if they're process oriented, or you know, more product oriented, so So that made me think. And another thing that Maria Marie, she also spoke, she was fantastic. And something she said, I love this. She said, a wide base of knowledge leads to hooks, that background knowledge can hang on. I love that, too. So, so many good sessions, so many things to think about. Is there anything else that we haven't covered? Or, you know, a favorite quote, or something that stands out?

Donell Pons:
25:28

So yeah, Lindsey, you had challenges to one point? Is there anything that you think could improve or anything like that, and so I did kind of write one down, and I'd like to share because it was, and I, I'm just kind of putting it out there to keep a thought on, I'm not sure it's really a trend or anything or anything we really need to be concerned about, maybe it will write itself, but one thing I'm becoming increasingly concerned about, there's some movies coming out. And at some point, I think we're going to discuss surrounding teaching reading, and we've had great podcast series and various things. Some of the quotes that I've been hearing are making me a little bit concerned that people are not remembering that there is a segment of the population that truly does have dyslexia, dyslexia is a thing. It exists. And as I was telling some of you at different points, it's important for the students who do have dyslexia to know they have dyslexia, because Dyslexia has its reading difficulties and challenges. It impacts that part of of learning. But there's also other parts that come with that I live with people who have dyslexia, and trust me, it's a thing you want to know, to be aware of. Because there are different ways in which Oh, I can be prepared for this situation. Because I know this about myself, I have dyslexia, these are things that I know. And so it's better to know and be prepared. And the concern that I was hearing is just a few times and some particularly the movies, some quotes and things that made it sound like Well, everybody thinks they have dyslexia. And yes, there are individuals who do not have dyslexia but struggle with reading and they struggle with reading, there can be various reasons, one of which is the instruction is not very good, right? That's why we're trying to get excellent instruction in that tier one for everyone so that we can really see who those dyslexic students are the students who have dyslexia because those numbers should stay within a range. And when you see numbers wide and far of the range, then you know, you have you have challenges in your location. So I just wanted that was kind of concerning to me as to make sure that as we're having these conversations, we're being very clear about what it is that we're the messages that we're sending the things we're saying,

Lindsay Kemeny:
27:24

Stacey anything else any other like standout quotes, or anything else you want to share from a session?

Stacy Hurst:
27:30

Um, so many sessions, there really were too many. I wish there was a way that we could access all of them. I do want to say this session we attended with and I want to give credit, because the rock star to me is Julie Washington, but she, she presented with Carla Burrell, Stanford and Logan McWilliams in that session dynare. And I Yeah, they were fantastic. They were but I really appreciated the dialogue. Tracy Whedon was an attendant of that session, and there was dialogue between Julie and Tracy, what I really appreciated was the focus on the individual needs of the student and to stay away from making the conversation about culture or about politics, right? Like we're talking about that student you're working with and meeting their needs. And I think it was Julie Washington that said, if you ignore dialect, you will not produce the reader. And so when we're talking about translanguaging, which is the term that she has coined, then I think that no matter the dialogue, that's really important.

Lindsay Kemeny:
28:41

Okay, I have two things. Other things I wanted to mention. I love this quote. This was in a presentation by both Tracy Whedon and Rebecca Tolson and Rebecca Tolson said Don't let a schedule dictate what a student needs, let data dictate your decisions. And I love that that's so true. Sometimes we depend on that clock and our schedules, but let the data guide you. And Sonia Cobell, she was great. We were talking a lot about oral language. And she shared some research about when a teacher says something complex, the student says something complex in return. And I thought that was awesome. And a good reminder for us when we're working with younger children, especially sometimes we want to simplify things and definitely there are times we need to simplify but we can also elevate their language by using, you know, it's kind of like reminds me of our vocabulary episode. Okay, so let's close up any suggestions for future plain talk conferences. Like I would like to have more sessions repeated because you know, you had some of them, you just had one chance to get to and if there was another one you needed to go to, you couldn't get to it. So

Stacy Hurst:
29:53

I think that's a great suggestion and maybe having recordings available. I know that takes a little extra effort, but So, how worthwhile right? Crowds were an issue? Yeah, how many people and the venue and Donnelly you kept reminding us that they're kind of contracted with the venue. But I think the venue is not quite big enough. I mean, there were really was an incident I experienced to directly have with the escalator. And if you're listening to this, and you were there, you know, by talking about it, it was literally almost a physical situation, we got pushed into the crowd at the top of the escalator, the people at the bottom of the escalator literally had to walk backwards. Otherwise, you know, we would all be in a mess. And then there was, John has work session, I heard it wasn't the only one. But there were literally people sitting behind the screen at the front behind her. In the aisle, if there were a fire, we would have been in danger all of us would have. So I think that is something that probably should be looked at.

Lindsay Kemeny:
30:58

I think they they did good. Because like the second day, I think that escalator thing happened the first day. So the second day, oh, let's open up the stairwell. And we can do stairs too. So that was good to kind of spaces out. And we did have three floors. And I think last year, we just had two floors. Right? So those were some good changes, you know, they had made Donald did you have something?

Donell Pons:
31:18

Well, just along those lines, what I what suffers, beyond all of those other things where you feel like you're too crowded, that sort of thing. I think what suffers is that people then start to leave sessions early, because they're fearful, they can't get a seat in the next session. So you lose out on being able to linger, have conversations, I saw that happening less and less, I felt like and I started to also be impacted by it, worrying about being able to get to the next session to get a seat. So you know, that's the other thing you have to think about when you're putting the conference together is sure sure we can get this many people in there. But then how does it impact the person's quality of experience to

Stacy Hurst:
31:54

that's a good point, because the q&a at the end of sessions I they're my favorite parts of the session, right? When you get to hear and see those interactions.

Lindsay Kemeny:
32:04

One thing as I missed from that was different from last year is like the paper program. I really like having a program to look and star my sessions and go back and forth. And honestly, it's faster and easier for me to use it an actual physical program than the app, trying to find the session. What is it go back? You know, anyway, I missed that. And I know we're like digital age, but I'm like, Oh, I wanted my program.

Stacy Hurst:
32:33

Yeah, I was feeling that too, for sure.

Lindsay Kemeny:
32:37

But it was a great conference. Thank you guys for sharing your thoughts.

Stacy Hurst:
32:42

Yeah, thank you for the conversation as ever, and thanks to the listener whether you attended or not, I hope you got something out of this conversation. And I hope that more people have the opportunity to attend conferences and learn because there were a lot of really great things. Why is it called plain talk to if we ever heard that Do either of you know, plain talk about literacy and learning? Well, let's end with the question. Everybody Google and find out but it is really actionable, right? So maybe that's where the plain talk comes from, or we're keeping it real, which is I think what we did today, thank you, Lindsey for guiding our discussion. And thank you, Danielle, for sharing your insights as well. I always learned a lot and thank you listeners for joining us and we will be so happy to have you join us on our next episode of literacy talks.

Narrator:
33:38

Thanks for listening to literacy talks, the podcast series for literacy leaders and champions everywhere. Literacy talks comes to you and your colleagues from Reading Horizons were reading momentum begins. Visit reading horizons.com/literacy talks often for resources, ideas and great literacy learning conversations. Subscribe to Our Podcast digest and you'll always be up to date on all things literacy. See you next time.